Does anyone else have a problem with crooked fonts?

Discussion in 'Questions or troubles updating' started by dennismk, Feb 17, 2005.

  1. dennismk

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    Katie, you were great to get back to me so quickly...now my question is this:

    When I use (and then reduce) most standard, non-italic fonts that are straight-lined (such as Arial or Times Roman), they end up not being straight on their horizontal axis (for example, the 'O' in 'PO' drops slightly below the horizontal alignment of the 'P'). The result is a line of text that looks wavy instead of straight. I thought at first that this was a WYSIWYG situation on my laptop, but when I printed out a sample page it contained the very same irregularities along the horizontal axis. It does not always happen when I use the same font but enlarge it so that it is twice the initial size.

    Has anyone else experienced this?

    Dennis
  2. KD-did

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    dennismk, now that is a very interesting observation and the actual cause be hard to pinpoint. It maybe something leftover from the source of the font or even the limitation of the font set. I can't recall ever experiencing the problem firsthand BUT I may have a work around. Try doing your text at the largest stable size...export the file in a transparent format. and then import to a prepared or blank canvas and then enlarge to your desired font size.
  3. dennismk

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    Katie, about that crooked font problem....

    Katie,

    On closer examination (and looking at several fonts, New York, Garamond,Times Roman and Book Antiqua, at 0.028 scale), it appears that the following letters and numbers appear as 'elevated': abcdeostuvw 3567890.

    All other numbers and letters appear as if lining up on a slightly lower horizontal line.

    This does not occur with Arial.

    I thought it might have had something to do with the way I updated my version, but I tried Logo Creator at v3.5 alone, then 3.6.1 updating through the Corporate expansion sets and then updating through the updater first THEN the expansion sets (I have done beta testing before).

    Do you think it may have to do with a difference between the boxed version of v3.5 and the demo version that you have here? I just cannot believe that you wouldn't have heard about it from someone else before now.

    Thank you for your assistance....your customer service is primo.

    Dennis in Vancouver, Washington
  4. KD-did

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    Dennis, the Summit licensed boxed set and the downloaded TLC could very easily have different sources for the fonts which would explain some inherent differences in the font sets. It wasn't apparent to me until I started using The Font Thing that all fonts are not downloaded at the same point size. The larger the point size the easier to detect the slight irregularities in a font set . I like to use the ability to use my own text with TFT so I can see if there maybe spacing issues with letters or other issues before I make a font choice.

    In all honesty I didn't even think of why when looking at font choices either ebbeded or system fonts that aren't all the same size . Without looking at hundreds and hundreds of pages of programming code for both the boxed and downloaded TLC I have no way of knowing exactly what differences there are between the 2 versions and how the update would or would not effect the fonts included in the sets.
  5. dennismk

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    Katie, just so you know, I did delete the boxed version of 3.5 and loaded the demo version of 3.6.1....and got the same result. Is this something that could be fixed in a future update? I switched to Arial and the font lined up normally.
  6. KD-did

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    Dennis, did you also forgo installing the "Corporate expansion sets" you mentioned?

    You have provided some interesting information and I think you ought to PM laughingbird (Marc) with your findings. Also tell Marc what OS you are using so he can check and see if it is TLC for both versions or not. and to correct if necessary for the eBook and Box Cover Creator while he is in the process of the final tweeking.

    One question that pops into my mind is when you have used those system fonts in another program do the same irregularities show up? I am aware from doing some reading recently that MAC has font issues that Windows apps don't have. That there are converters so there can be MAC to Win crossovers.

    Fonts that are in system fonts can be easily replaced by taking them out of the systems font folder and replacing with fresh downloads from free font sites or off purchased font CDs'. Because I have so many fonts on my machine...close to 3000 I know I wouldn't be able to tell you if I had the fonts before or after I had TLC on my computer. ....I have no way of knowing if a font that is already installed if TLC would overwrite them.
  7. BFS

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    Yes - having the same problem in version 4.1.

    Other than this issue I have a useable logo. W/o resolution for this I can't really use what I created in this software unless there is an easy work-around.

    Aligning letters on a straight horizontal axis sure seems like one of the most fundamental things this program should do.
  8. BFS

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    forgot to mention - the other alignment problem I see is between letters. For example - if I type the word (all caps) EYE, the space between the first E and the Y is different than between the Y and the second E.
  9. KD-did

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    BFS, it is definitely worse with some fonts that others.
  10. ngb222

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    This is driving me nuts!

    I have this problem all the time.
    My words are all crooked when I shrink them.
    It looks very unprofessional.
    check it out at http://askmepc.com the top part where I have "website
    design,graphic design, and website hosting".
    Ugh!
  11. KD-did

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    I would try a different font as it very well be an issue that is inherent flaw in the font itself from the time the font was made.
  12. latenights

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    crooked fonts

    Let me bite on this one: Finally my theory has been vindicated...

    I had this crooked font problem and thought it was a bad install of TLC or the font sets, so I reinstalled many times. Even downgraded to TLC 4.1 and 4.0 with the same results. Noone on the forum seemed to be having this problem so I kept quiet. I simply chose a font that lined up, but this was not the answer. It seemed to occur only after I had been individually resizing objects. I had to settle on a font that did not look crooked like Arial.

    It seemed to improve when I chose export options and resized the whole logo by changing the canvas size. So that is how I generally worked around it, but I believe there is some problem in this area. I even thought it was greeking effect but it appeared on the print output as well.

    Try the above suggestion and let us know if you see any improvement.

    Cheers from a 50+ in the French Caribbean

    /latenights
  13. KD-did

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    It stands to reason that in a graphic application inherent flaws would just be more obvious than in a word processing application... You wouldn't notice the inherent flaws until they sized much larger than the normal range of sizes used in word processing applications. All embedded fonts were purchased and licensed from the font foundry and you get them as they are. Font foundries for the most part didn't make fonts for use in graphic applications, the one exception would be those fonts that were/ are made for and sold to the sign making industry.

    A classical example of an inherent flaw would be in the embedded font "Shapes" where a lower case c makes a big circle and an uppercase C makes a small circle.There is no changing the font map.
  14. taxguy

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    I have the same issue with crooked fonts

    I've been using this software for about a year now, and I'm thankful I checked the forum to see someone else is having this issue. I was beginning to wonder if it was user error, or I missed something in the manual that I never read.

    If you find any other "good" fonts other than Arial to use, or find a decent workaround, then please post and let me know.

    It's a thorn in my side as I want (and need) text in my designs. So far, the crooked text has been the only problem of mine that hasn't been fixed.

    And I don't know much, but I do know that even when changing the font size by .5 point, it immediately makes the text look crooked. So I'm choosing at this point to not believe that the font is inherently crooked, and it only comes to life when you resize. Or else it seems the size of the crookedness (is that a word?) would increase and correspond to the size of the font you choose. That doesn't seem to be the case. It is either straight (ok), or is crooked and stays the same crooked text in absolute crooked values no matter what size text you choose.

    Thanks.
  15. KD-did

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    There is NO way that Marc can fix a crooked font, the font appear crooked because that is how they were constructed by the font foundry (the font makers themselves) making for the inherent flaws. Fonts come as they are and ONLY the font makers themselves can change them and make them available for download.If the font maker didn't take the time or have the software at the time the fonts were made you are going to see inherent flaws such a spacing differences that are only MORE apparent in graphic programs.

    Perhaps if you understand the process of making fonts you can better understand why there are inherent files in some fonts and why as the software for making fonts has improved there are less inherent flaws in the newer generations of fonts.
    http://www.jawarts.com/FontBuild.htm
  16. taxguy

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    Holy cow, thanks for the info. I think I just learned something. So should I ignore old system fonts in my designs and look for newer fonts to download you think?
  17. KD-did

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    There are so any fonts that look the same you should be able to find something that has the look and feel that are suitable substitutes in some cases the font makers have done the work and re-released the fonts under different names so they could charge for what they originally gave away.

    Here is a decent resource to help you locate replacement fonts. This list will help you find many of these lookalike fonts, font aliases, clones, and close-match fonts. It's not a comprehensive list by any means, but it is a start and encompasses typefaces from many well-known sources including Monotype, Bitstream, Adobe, Corel, and Linotype AG.
    http://desktoppub.about.com/cs/fonts/a/lookalikefonts.htm

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